Event Photography: Providing a Valuable Service for Clients

Aug 10

Featuring Gene hwang, Co-Founder of orange photography

Gene Hwang is an internationally ranked pinball player, an award-winning polaroid shooter and the co-founder of Orange Photography, the San Francisco Bay Area's premier corporate photography agency, servicing large corporations and organizations across the United States.

Here’s a glimpse of what you’ll learn:

Headshot booths have become popular at events and can be a fun way to engage employees and provide marketing assets for companies.
Offering different service levels and including keywords for employees in headshots can enhance the experience for clients.
Working in the events industry allows for a variety of learning opportunities specialized to the field.
Lighting and sound are important factors that can impact attendees' and speakers' experiences at events.
Good production values can benefit everyone involved and can result in better marketing assets for the event.
The level of an event can determine whether professional planners are necessary or not.
Budget constraints can affect the quality of an event and event organizers must work creatively to optimize available resources.
Asset management options, like facial recognition software and keyword association, can help manage large amounts of event data.
Photographers utilize techniques to determine the best angle for taking headshots, including taking shots straight on and from each side.
Personal connections and networks within the industry can provide opportunities for informal gatherings and professional development.

In this episode…

From the challenges of shooting speakers in different rooms to the intricacies of managing vast quantities of event assets, event photography plays a pivotal role in capturing the essence of an event.

In this episode of the “Solutions Seekers” podcast, we had the pleasure of chatting with Gene Hwang, a seasoned event photographer and co-founder of Orange Photography, the San Francisco Bay Area's premier corporate photography agency. With decades of experience in the industry, Gene shared valuable insights and anecdotes about the art and science of event photography, shedding light on the behind-the-scenes efforts that make events truly unforgettable. Gene shares that good lighting not only enhances the overall ambiance but also allows photographers to capture captivating images that truly reflect the essence of the event. Sound quality, another pivotal element, ensures the success of an event, significantly impacting the audience's engagement and overall satisfaction.

So whether you're an event professional looking for tips on how to make every moment picture-perfect or simply curious about the art of event photography, this episode is a must-listen!

DOWNLOAD THE TOP TAKEAWAYS FROM THIS PODCAST EPISODE FOR FREE

Resources Mentioned in this episode

Sponsor for this episode…

This episode is brought to you by Kennedy Events.

Kennedy Events creates stress-free conferences and events, providing expert management and design for all your corporate event needs—from in-person to hybrid and virtual events.

To learn more about our services, visit our website at www.kennedyevents.com and schedule a consultation today to find out how we can guide you in making your event successful.

Transcript

Paige Buck [00:00:00]:

Hi, and welcome to the Kennedy Events podcast. I'm your host, Paige Buck. Past guests include Dave Ferriss of EPMC, Tommy Halvorson of Hospitality Group, and K’Dee Miller of Patina Pictures. And today I'm talking with Gene Hwang, an internationally ranked pinball player first and foremost, award-winning Polaroid shooter, and the co-founder of Orange Photography, the San Francisco Bay Area's premier corporate photography agency servicing large corporations and organizations across the United States.

Before we get started, today's episode is brought to you by Kennedy Events. Kennedy Events creates stress-free conferences and events providing expert management and design for all your corporate event needs, from in-person to hybrid and virtual. And you can learn more about us at kennedyevents.com.

So, hi, Gene. Thanks for being here.

Gene Hwang [00:00:52]:

Hello. How's it going, Paige?

Paige Buck [00:00:53]:

It's going great. I think you and I have known each other for more years than I want to say out loud, but from the very origins of your company. I've watched you grow, but I'd love to hear you describe what that trajectory looked like, how you got started, what the idea looked like, and, at the time, what you imagined the growth trajectory of the business might look like.

Gene Hwang [00:01:17]:

Yeah, so we started in 2001. It was three of us. It was Jack Huynh, who's currently still my business partner, and also Andy Berry, who, he spun off a few years out. And actually, Andy and Jack were talking about the idea. Jack was my roommate at the time because the first tech boom had just kind of bust right at 2000, 2001. And so a lot of people were out of work, and they were talking about ideas on what could they do. And I still somehow had my tech job in tech. It was, I worked on the agency side, but they were talking about doing photography because we knew digital was where everything was moving. And in 2001, the digital cameras, the pro-level stuff, wasn't super good. The first cameras we bought were three megapixels, so your iPhone is like, this is twelve or something megapixels, so it's already much higher res than the pro cameras at the time. And so they were kind of bandying about the idea of, maybe we can do this event photography thing because our weddings or events and both, and I would kind of shoot little holes into their ideas when they were talking. And eventually it came out. It was like, okay, this seems like a good idea. We can go do everything digital, which is, I think, the way of the future. Then we don't need to have a lab and all these processing costs and chemicals that are harmful for the environment, all this stuff. So we were like, talking about it and we said, let's just do this. And then we were kind of strategizing, how do we do this? We had some experience in photography. Andy actually went to CCAC, as it was called back in the day. I had been doing freelance photography on the side. Jack actually didn't know much photography but he was going on a vacation to Vietnam and Southeast Asia and just asked for some tips on how to use a camera. And [he] came back and he had the best eye of all of us. And we're just like, okay, yeah, you just have this magical skill. So we decided to do events and weddings to start off with because we didn't need to have a studio or anything. And we kind of strategized, like, how do we get into this world that we don't really know that well? And so we looked at the organizations. There's a lot of industry groups here that are really great. And I think we're very fortunate in Bay Area to have really strong chapters of some of these organizations. So, we joined a couple of those. We also did some events for non-profits, for fundraisers where we would just donate our services because people didn't know who we were. And so, that's how we got started. And it was also hard coming up with a name because we weren't sure what to call ourselves because most photography studios are led by a single photographer, so it's that person's name. And then the three of us were like, Huynh, Hwang, and Barry, which sounds like an injury lawyer firm or something. We were like, that doesn't sound good. And Gene, Jack, and Andy sound like an auto-parts store or something. So we were coming around, seeing what would be a good name. We liked the color orange. Jack actually, I think, already had bought Orange Photography because back then, the domain names, you could still get some.

Paige Buck [00:04:14]:

That was the thing. I better get this domain, and it better be the full business name.

Gene Hwang [00:04:18]:

Yeah, you don't want the dot net or something or all that. I mean, now there's better ones, but back then– so, yeah, we had it. We were like, Orange Photography could work because the Golden Gate Bridge is international orange. The Giants are orange and black. So it's kind of a very colorful color that means something to San Francisco. It's a word that doesn't have a lot of words that rhyme with it. Unlike Jack and I's last names, which are hard to pronounce and spell. And also, it means it's a food and a color. A lot of creative businesses seem to have, you know it's a bright color. So we really liked that name, and so it kind of worked. And then we just went out there and started doing it. I don't know that we had, we did have a plan for how the company might grow. And it's actually, because we did write a business plan, like trying to get a loan, get started. And we did actually have the plan of what we kind of are today, which is more of an agency model where we work with photographers because we have kind of a core team, and then we bring in talent depending on where the jobs are and what kind of talent is required. And so, even though that was very, very early, it kind of is true to what we are now. We had to kind of adjust during the pandemic because I think everybody did. And so it's kind of been tweaked a little bit. But also, we're a lot older than we were when we started because that was 2001, so it's been 23 years. So we've kind of doubled in age or more.

Paige Buck [00:05:43]:

Right. Well, it's a helpful reminder, I think, to think about how technology has changed, even how our business decisions have changed. What seemed like incredibly, I don't know, risky and forward thinking, pure digital, no print. Because you're reminding me that first when we met, I was in one of those lightly affiliated, both non-profits and industry associations, the Chamber of Commerce. So it was like a foot in the door in a way, to promote yourself, I'm sure, to the business community and get your name out there. But also, my immediate predecessor kept printed photos and negatives in binders, in plastic sleeves that we would flip through. And I probably still ordered prints of some of the best images afterwards. For what, I don't know, posterity? So it was a real time moment of change, right, in the early aughts.

Gene Hwang [00:06:42]:

Yeah. I don't know if you went to college and they had, like, party pics for things where literally you'd have to order prints. It's weird. I don't know what school– because there's the whole industry of school photography and youth sports and all that. And all that stuff used to be prints, too, or your graduation thing that they'd mail you the little–.

Paige Buck [00:07:03]:

Oh yeah. I have photos from semi-formal dances from college. But now, I think the only prints that I think of are my nephew's little school shots.

Gene Hwang [00:07:12]:

But it is nice. I really do like the tangibility of printed stuff, and we mostly don't have any of that nowadays. Everybody's got everything on the phone. But that's why I kind of like doing it for myself and I try to promote it. Sometimes, we've actually been successful in promoting printed stuff. I mean, there's like photo booth stuff where it's printed. But, one time I got a client for a couple of years to do a super VIP event where we actually shot Polaroids, which was nice because people don't get Polaroids anymore. And it's kind of novel, sort of, that you get something real. It's nice. I just have some from this weekend where there are actual photos that people have. It's a one-off, and then we don't have to do any work on the back end for that as well. So, that was kind of a selfish motivation.

Paige Buck [00:07:56]:

What resonates for people, and you mentioned photo booths, people love novel, lightweight ephemera. It's even more special now that we don't get prints of every single event that we attend or every major life moment, right? Like you said, those live on our phone. Are there other ways you've seen things like that shift in the, how many years now that you've been in business? 22.

Gene Hwang [00:08:19]:

Yeah. 22, yeah. That's the thing that's interesting because people like the photo booths and photos printed of any sort because it's a real thing. The nice thing, most of the photo booth printing or photo event printing, there's kind of levels of this. They vary. But I like it if it's a traditional photo, like a Polaroid type thing. But this isn't really practical for the most part, where the digital printing is pretty nice and it works really well. But there have been different things. I've seen some of the photo booth companies do the animated ones that you tilt and they animate, which are neat. And there was one 3D printing, it would make a little model of you, but it hasn't taken off. I thought it would take off because that's kind of neat. You basically get a little action figure of yourself, and it just does a three–

I think it might just be that the 3D printing technology isn't fast enough to make them in a reasonable amount of time at some super high-end private events where there's much smaller guest list and something there. Maybe there's a formal dinner, sit-down. You can kind of do it up front, and then have them–

Paige Buck [00:09:34]:

Pick it up on your way out the door. Yeah, those are great. What do you find, since you've been in this for some time, and it came out of this idea you bandied about for a while. What do you still find fulfilling? What gets you out of bed in the morning to go to work at Orange every day?

Gene Hwang [00:09:53]:

Well, I mean, I love events, and I think probably for yourself, the fun thing about events is they're real. They're like this real thing happening. Not–liike we're on Zoom, this is fine for this, but I really don't like being on Zoom meetings for work-meeting type things. And I know we're very fortunate. I think we don't have to do it as much as people that have a desk job type thing or tech thing where they do that, or they work in remote. And being live, in person is really great. Just like I meet lots of different people, and I think this is the other thing. People think maybe you're a photographer, you're always photographing, but you're not actually doing sales, marketing, just interacting with clients on the computer before the events. That's a lot more of the actual work. But I love that part. And I also love being onsite at the events because I have access to so many different types of things that I probably wouldn't ever have. And sometimes I have no idea what's going on. Like a medical conference, they might be talking about things I really don't understand, but a lot of times you might get a keynote that's a very interesting person. We just had an interesting one where the keynote speaker is a person who does poetry, and he had his promo image, and it was shot by us, by one of somebody on our team, and he didn't know that we were coming. And so, it was kind of neat to meet someone that was actually using some of our images for their marketing.

Paige Buck [00:11:19]:

That’s rewarding to see that. You're like, oh, that's us actually, quite proud.

Gene Hwang [00:11:24]:

Yeah, but I really enjoy– I do a lot of the travel jobs from the destinations, and incentive programs are always fun, just because the crowd is very relaxed and having a great time, and it's usually in somewhere fun. But even the user conferences, the sales kickoffs, just the general conferences are pretty interesting because I can always learn something. Although, when I'm photographing, it's a little hard to listen-listen, because I'm kind of focused on what I'm doing. So a lot of times I can't actually hear what's going on in the sense of paying attention because I'm being very superficial and just being like, I want to make this look interesting more than understanding what they're talking about. So sometimes someone's like, oh, what did they say? And I'm like, I don't know too much because I couldn't listen into them as much.

Paige Buck [00:12:12]:

But you've been in here the whole time, why haven't you?

Gene Hwang [00:12:14]:

Exactly.

Paige Buck [00:12:15]:

Yeah, taken all of that in. What stands out to you, to the extent that you can pick up on this because you're not just trying to find the sweetest shot. What stands out to you about what sets an everyday event apart from something that really is meaningful to the participants?

Gene Hwang [00:12:37]:

There's a few things. Obviously, things running very well and professionally. I think when you're in [the] events industry, you look for maybe the smaller things because at a certain level the big, big things should be taken care of, and then the more fine details are the things that really make something run smoother or be more of a great experience. And the one little thing that's my little weird pet peeve, which doesn't really apply to me, but when I see it, is when they have like buffet-style meal situations, but they push it against the wall when you could go on both sides.

Paige Buck [00:13:12]:

When it could be double-sided and twice as fast.

Gene Hwang [00:13:16]:

Yeah, and I've seen them sometimes they have it for the vendor meals where they only have the utensils on one half, but it is a two-sided thing and you're like, this is not very–

What I like, selfishly, is good lighting because lighting really helps. And some of that's the venue, venues just have some stuff built in, but it depends on the level. I understand there's budgets and there's lots of things to account for, and that's not always the most important thing for the attendees. But, a lot of times having decent lighting for a speaker is kind of important because I've been to places that have really bad lighting. That's when you really notice it. Same with sound, which doesn't matter for the photography, but for the event it's important that the people can hear and things. So, those kind of things are things that I kind of notice. There's a vibe that certain groups that we work with, they're just so on top of it, and we know everything's going to be good. When you have a certain client, you're like, okay, this is going to be great, and that's always nice to know that you're working with, I mean, we're all professionals, but some people I think they think on the level of the production as it is for the attendees, but also what's going to work for all the rest of us that have little roles to do. And I think the top level folks can also accommodate all those things or have them in mind up front so that they can make sure it works for every level. Because the photos are important. That's why they're paying us to shoot them because they need them for marketing or whatever else. So if they can get good assets as well as a great experience for the attendees, that's really key.

Paige Buck [00:14:55]:

Yeah. Are there some folks in the industry that stand out to you, as like, when they hire me, I know that it's going to go smoothly on site. It's going to be easy.

Gene Hwang [00:15:05]:

Well, we love working with you, of course.

Paige Buck [00:15:07]:

I wasn't looking for a pat on the back!

Gene Hwang [00:15:10]:

I just had a recent one with the Event Studio and we really like working with them. They're fantastic. I just came back from that, and then one of the bigger companies that we work in layers because they do a lot of really huge events, and we work through Eventrix sometimes. But also i4D, but a lot of times there's so many vendors involved.

Paige Buck [00:15:32]:

What is i4D?

Gene Hwang [00:15:34]:

They're out of Chicago and they produce a lot of large tech-based conferences that are usually just in various locations, and they do some incentive programs for the same companies.

Paige Buck [00:15:50]:

But really large users. Yeah. That's the other thing. Almost every day I'll have a conversation with a client or a vendor, and they'll say, “So do you know so and so? We're also talking to them.” Or, “Do you know so and so? Because we used to work with them.”

There are so many of us, so many, so many really awesome ones and so many you could just pass right by and think very little of. They might have a skill we haven't had a chance to see them exhibit. That's great. Do you think that, in general, folks do a good job of considering what their vendor’s needs are on-site?

Gene Hwang [00:16:27]:

I think it's more based on the level of the event because sometimes you have events that are planned from somebody internal because it's a smaller event, and so they just have some internal person that's overseeing it. And they're often, I think, they get a lot more on their–I think they realize the value of having professional planners when their scope of their event is maybe a little bit above where their experience is, but they're doing it for whatever reason. Maybe they didn't have the budget to hire someone externally. And they're just like, you need to take care of this. And sometimes in those events, the things, because when you're in this enough, you know all the little things that make the differences, and then they don't have those things accounted for because–and that might be a budget thing, too. They're like, listen, we can't light up the stage, or it's going to be in this room because it has to be in whatever else. So I do notice that there's definitely levels, and some of it's based on budget. Because you feel bad if someone just doesn't have a budget, and they're locked into this particular venue that they have to use. Maybe it's because it's a university event, they have to do it on their own campus. And it's not super ideal, versus, oh, we've got great production, we got a whole lighting team, we got everything. That's always better. But I understand that it's not. And I like the challenge. That's why I like doing events, because sometimes you have great setup, sometimes it's super not ideal. It keeps the creative juices just from this perspective of, okay, how am I going to make this look good? Because we want it to look good. And sometimes, that's one thing with the higher versus lower level budget. I was just doing an event in Orlando this last week, and they had keynotes that were in the big fancy areas, lots of breakouts, and some smaller ones that were just in different lighting situations. I could shoot from the side on the keynote stage, and everything looks good on the side because it wraps around a little bit, where if I want to get a siding on a speaker in another room, you might see just the air walls of the conference center or something, which isn't as ideal.

Paige Buck [00:18:29]:
That does not make a good background. So you're basically saying if you have to shoot at different levels, you can't get complacent. You're never going to get too comfortable in your job.

Gene Hwang [00:18:38]:

Yeah, which is good. I know some of my friends who do event photography, they don't appreciate the challenging situations as much because it does make it harder sometimes to get what we know what the clients want. But it's kind of fun. But it also can be a little frustrating when it's super dark or something, and just really hard to get the best shots of things.

Paige Buck [00:19:01]:

When you have a really great client or a really great agency relationship, do you come to them with those things? Do they give you a chance to articulate pre-event what would help you make it even better?

Gene Hwang [00:19:17]:

Sometimes they do, sometimes they don't. I think it just depends on what it is and where they're going to be and everything. Only when it's really, really bad or challenging, I'll say some stuff up front, maybe, just to let them know that this might be really tough if you want to do it this way. Because, you know how it is. Sometimes a client wants to change things, and the plan was this the whole time, and suddenly it's not. And they want to do something different, and so they have to adjust. And then it's like, well, this whole thing was built to be this way. And now it's not because you want to change it, which is fine, but it's going to be–

So we let them know, especially when it's that kind of thing where the client is changing it last second because we're like, okay, this is going to impact [the shot]. They're going to be standing behind a super bright window instead of on the stage, or whatever it is. So it's going to make the images not as great for this or that. Or, a lot of times, there's these last second group shots because the clients go, everybody's here, let's do this. And we're like, oh, this is really not a good area to do this in. Or they want like 50 people with no risers or no kind of elevation.

Paige Buck [00:20:21]:

Here, Gene, climb up this stepladder! You’ll be fine. Nobody's spotting you.

Gene Hwang [00:20:28]:

Yeah, we always try to give, on those type of situations, give them a heads up that it might not be super ideal. But it's always, “yes, and.” It's like, yes, we could do that, but let me also say these things. And sometimes they don't care. They're like, we just want to get everybody together. We're here and it doesn't have to be super formal or whatever.

Paige Buck [00:20:48]:

Yeah, it doesn't have to be perfect. Yeah, that's a really good note. What have you seen? I know you have some new, some things you've tried over times, you've expanded your offerings. Before we started recording, you were telling me about Digital Asset Management. What does that look like, and what problem are you solving for folks?

Gene Hwang [00:21:07]:

Yeah, so we've been doing a lot of bigger, bigger events and also working with some clients on a long-term, repeat basis that they've kind of been, I think we were talking about sometimes the issues, like finding stuff. And sometimes you know that you have something somewhere. I know we got a shot of something from here. And now both the software and, well, the software itself is getting better, that you can manage this stuff. There used to only be these certain options for companies that were really high-end or really small, and now there's a lot more. And since we're doing a lot of work with clients on a repeat basis, we can keyword things. But now there's AI that is smart and can recognize you a lot better, too. We did something recently for a big company, where, I think it was just their general main conference for all their internal teams, and they were saying, let's try this out because they kind of wanted to see how it works. So we identified, you can identify key people where it just was looking at their faces. And so the CEO is speaking to open the conference. So we had some nice shots of him, put it into there, and then you can just say, hey, this is a key person. Just show me all the photos with this person. And then the software is pretty impressive now that it can find people. There was a reception and it's dark in the back, and he's like back there talking to somebody in the corner, and it would show that photo. And so the software and the AI within it for facial recognition is so good that it really helps, but then you just need more data in there. So we kind of backfilled from some other events we did, and you're showing that if you keep keywords associated with images and people, you can really find things, so that you can say, oh, when we were in Vegas for that conference that one year. You can just put Vegas and see all the shots if you don't remember which year it was. Because I don't know about you, but for me, a lot of this stuff blends together.

Paige Buck [00:23:01]:

Running together now, yep. It’s smart enough to layer in if you're like, I'm looking for casual shots, or I'm looking for more formal shots, or if you were to keyword those.

Gene Hwang [00:23:12]:

Yeah, and we've been doing this for a while on certain level jobs where we can have a data manager who's going to add in the keywords because if you don't have the keywords, they could still do stuff based on looking for things, visually. But now that the data asset management programs are just way more user-friendly, that's where we've been able to set it up. Because we use it for ourselves as well. For the clients, it's become very useful because they need to find people or speakers from a certain thing, or they need to find– especially like you were saying, the keywords is the key. As long as you have that integrated within the photos, then suddenly you can find all kinds of stuff, and you can identify and pull assets much quicker.

Paige Buck [00:24:01]:

It sounds like the service, all it includes, not just the software, but the implementation by that data manager of identifying the keywords they're going to want to be considering for the program. Looking at the assets and thinking about what keywords are coming forward as being related inside.

Gene Hwang [00:24:21]:

Right. And that's where we have to work up front with the client because there's a little more planning involved because we need to know what is important to them. Most companies have a lot of internal stuff that they call things and stuff. So it's like what do you call this, and what's important? How do you want to find things? So it takes a little bit of more upfront work of thinking things out and mapping it.

Paige Buck [00:24:46]:

Is it the team, is it the piece of software they're talking about on the stage?

Gene Hwang [00:24:50]:

Yeah. And then just general, like what category, what words might they use for categories? Because we use stuff, sometimes, in the events world, we call things things, but people don't call them that thing.

Paige Buck [00:25:02]:

Mainstage, that might not be their word for– yeah, anything as simple as that. That's fascinating. Do you think there's a lot of promise for future demand for that?

Gene Hwang [00:25:14]:

I think for a certain level size. I think even events groups, like the agencies and stuff can use it for their own stuff. Because we do a lot of work with the same clients over and over, and I think they have their own needs. A lot of times we're shooting setups and things like that for them. And I know that sometimes they'll even hire us just because the client doesn't need photography or doesn't want it. They might just hire us just to get some of the setups and things. And that's useful for them because they can show, oh, this is how this location is. Because some people have some exclusive of some locations, or they want to show how a place can look, especially some of these big places like Levi Stadium or even Moscone. Those things can look so different depending on how they're produced.

Paige Buck [00:25:59]:

When you're at that scale, being able to visualize what that production looks like, it's really challenging.

Gene Hwang [00:26:06]:

Yeah. And so on the event side, that's useful to show because I think people can imagine a little bit, but it's easier to show and say, this is how we can set it up like this and that. So, yeah, we've noticed that it has been something that we never were trying to sell necessarily, but we had worked with clients, like bigger clients that they have their own team and they're doing that. And so we were like, okay, well, we would mention that just to other clients because they're like, how do you find your assets? Because if we've done work for them for years, then we have a backlog, and we do keyword some basic stuff into what we're doing for ourselves so we can find stuff later. And then now that there's options for ways to implement it at a reasonable price for smaller or even for bigger companies, we've just been like, okay, we can maybe do this if you want. And Jack's super technical. I'm pretty nerdy that way, too. So we've been like, okay, might as well because we evolved. We used to do more photo booth stuff, but the team internally didn't love it. And so we were like, well, if the team doesn't love it, then we don't have to do it because we don't want to make people do things they don't love. We said we can eliminate that part. We're only doing more fancy integrations, maybe, that have not, just like a standard photo booth of just taking pictures and maybe printing, or maybe not, or sharing on an iPad and doing more activation based stuff for anything that we are doing this photo booth-ish.

Paige Buck [00:27:36]:

You mentioned that you also do, often are called on to do, headshot photography at events, which I think is fantastic in either an industry event, a networking event, or All-Hands now, where you're gathering your team who have now fled to the four winds, the four corners of the earth, and are excited because when else are you going to get that shot?

Gene Hwang [00:27:59]:

Yeah, that's been popular. We had been doing it pre-pandemic, but the headshot station, headshot booth is kind of the term, I feel like. I don't know if there's a standard industry description of it, but that's what we call it. It's more high volume, and we've been doing that a lot, like you said, at All-Hands. A lot of these companies are having their first All-Hands since the pandemic. So they want to have people having some shots because a lot of them have their internal systems or their Slack or whatever, their own internal Facebook that they want to have everybody. And for LinkedIn, because sometimes it's surprising when you look someone up on LinkedIn, and they've got like a picture. You're like, you probably want to have something a little more professional, maybe.

Paige Buck [00:28:42]:

Is that also the photo from your dating site?

Gene Hwang [00:28:45]:

Yeah. And so the headshot booths have been a really good thing for us. We like them. They're pretty fun. We've got the system down pretty well. There's different ways that we can do it for the clients with service levels and things like that. And a lot of them want, like you're saying, if we can have the keywords built in because the employees need to get their images somehow. So we either have their email or something, and then we can usually pass that back to the team. So they have that as well. And I like them, they're fun because they're a little high pace because you're trying to get through a lot of people. But it's pretty fun, we like to have fun with them. You get to meet a lot of the employees, and they're always, well, some of the companies force them to do it. So not everybody's excited. But a lot of times people are excited, and we tell them you can have multiple people because some people–actually there's the people that love it and then the people that are kind of indifferent. And the people love it, one of them [asked], “Can I sign up for it again?” And I [said], you can. And she's like, “I want to wear a different outfit every day.” She did it three times.

Paige Buck [00:29:49]:

That's great. I love it. And then you've got the people who are like, I'm doing this because I have to. The DMV photo.

Gene Hwang [00:29:57]:

Yeah.

Paige Buck [00:30:01]:

Was was I just thinking coming out of that? Oh, so when you were telling me when you guys were first getting started that you, smartly, joined a bunch of the industry associations, are there ones that you remain engaged with now?

Gene Hwang [00:30:13]:

Right now, mostly MPI right now is the main one here, just because our team is now distributed. So I'm the only owner, main business guy, who's in San Francisco, and I do a lot of the traveling jobs, and incentives, and those type of things where I'm out of town. So I just don't have as much time to go to things. So that's the one main membership.There’s a lot.

Paige Buck [00:30:40]:

So many, there’s ILEA, there's IMEX, yes, there’s across the board, and you could start getting quite dispersed, and that would be your full-time job.

Gene Hwang [00:30:49]:

Yeah. And I know also if I'm in one, I want to be participating somewhat at least. And so I figured it's better to just focus in on one. So we're just doing MPI right now here, and I think Jack was in the chapter out where he is in Michigan as well.

Paige Buck [00:31:06]:

Yeah, we also have a core team member who, Michigan is the spot now, who moved to Michigan, and now we're engaging in Michigan in fun ways. Are there things that you get out of that membership that extend outside of just being known to other agencies and peers? Do you feel like you get something out of industry forecasts?

Gene Hwang [00:31:31]:

Yeah, that's another thing where, I mean, a lot of times at the events I might be shooting, but sometimes I'm not, which is nice. But yeah, I like the industry, all the stuff within, I think it's fun to learn about that because from my side we see certain things. We are part of the event, but there's a lot more going into all the things. And one of the interesting things is that, I forget, there's always some interesting topics that are only for event professionals. So it's funny, because most of the conferences I shoot, I have no idea what the sessions are about because they're so specialized in some industry. But then usually there's some that make sense. But the event ones, I know what they're talking about, at least the subject. I have no expertise necessarily, but I know what the topics are. And the friendships. We actually have a neighborhood group because a lot of us live here in the Mission Dolores area. And so we try to get together. It ends up being much less frequently because we're all events people and busy at weird times, so we don't get to get together as much as we want. But when there's a nice day, we try to just pop out to Dolores Park because you know how it is with our schedules. We don't have regular hours, so if it happens to be super warm in the city and beautiful, people might be, hey, you want to just grab drinks for happy hour out at the park or something?

Paige Buck [00:32:54]:

You're the ones playing hooky in the park where I'm like, look at these lovely people that have time on their hands. I remember that. I remember that, and I miss it. Now I'm over in the East Bay, and I don't have that same sense of easy, quick, the density of my friends are right here.

Gene Hwang [00:33:11]:

Yeah, it's really great because we have quite a lot of us just within, I don't know how many blocks, but there's a little core. We got a little group online, and it's a lot of impromptu things or like holiday parties and stuff, but almost never are we all there because somebody's somewhere always.

Paige Buck [00:33:29]:

Of course. Or their head’s down finishing a proposal or tying something up to go onsite tomorrow. I get it, I get it. Well, I love that you and I have sort of like the same, I think maybe just timing wise, our insight into the industry is the same. My career was really growing in 2000, 2001. We both sort of came on this scene at the same time. So it's fun to talk to somebody who's got that same perspective. Throwback to pre iPhone days, for instance. Yeah, I know, it's really great. So, I wanted to wrap by asking you if there's somebody in particular that you really admire in the industry that stands out to you.

Gene Hwang [00:34:12]:

Yeah, I mean really, there's so many people, right? I love people in the events industry. We have all kinds of interesting people that are creative. We've got super intense people. We've got people across the board. And when you had mentioned that earlier, I was trying to think because I was like, I don't want to say any one person because it feels weird because there's probably someone else. Yeah, but I'll say Gary Murakami. He's actually one of our neighborhood folks as well, and he's always been super welcoming, very friendly. He's always been supportive of me and my business as we've grown. And he also knows his good side, so that's always kind of helpful. He's like, you always get my good side.

Paige Buck [00:35:00]:

I love that.

Gene Hwang [00:35:01]:

Yeah. And he's very involved in the industry at a high level, too. We're more here locally, but I think he's on some national boards and things like that, I think, I'm pretty sure. And so he represents our region as well as the industry as a whole really well. And he's a good friend. So I'll say Gary.

Paige Buck [00:35:25]:

It’s nice to have that more holistic vision now. I think as our company has grown, as I'm not in the boots on the ground quite as often, I think that might be the next place we need to be putting our attention. I just really appreciate knowing other people that are already doing that and what they get out of it. It's a great different perspective. You just gave me another sort of parting thing you could share with our audience, which is, is there a way to tell what your good side is, Gene, and what is the trick?

Gene Hwang [00:35:58]:

Well, one of the internal tips that we photographers have is when you're just looking at someone straight up, usually people part their hair to their good side because they've figured [it] out. That's why there's more of that face showing from the parted side. That's kind of a general tip. But that's where, with the headshot booths and headshot jobs that we do, and we see lots of people going through high volume, you can really tell. Some people actually look good. They mostly can pull it off. But some people, it's very dramatic. When we take the photos, we angle them a little from one side and then the other. And usually you can tell, like, if you take a picture slightly angled from each side and let someone else tell you because we ourselves are the worst judge of looking at ourselves. Most people will focus on what they don't like about themselves. When they look at a photo, whatever minimizes that thing they'll like the best. So let's say whatever it is you don't like, you'll notice less of it on whatever shot, but that might not actually be the better shot. If you have a partner or a best friend, have them tell you because they're going to know much better, and they're going to be honest with you about it. So yeah, just take pictures. Take it straight on. Take a little bit from one side, take it from the other side, and then show it to your best friend, and let them tell you which side is the best side.

Paige Buck [00:37:15]:

Trust them, even if you don't agree. I'm the person who hates 95% of the photos taken of me. It doesn’t matter what angle it's taken from, Yeah. I always have to have somebody else tell me.

Gene Hwang [00:37:30]:

That's really the best policy. I like it because sometimes when people are picking and their coworker who knows them comes over and is looking, they know because they can be objective about yourself. We cannot be ourselves for ourselves, looking at ourselves.

Paige Buck [00:37:49]:

Yeah. All right, final, final thought. Tell me what you love about pinball and why it has captured your heart.

Gene Hwang [00:38:00]:

I like pinball for the same reason I like film photography. I think it's the analog nature of it. It's very analog. Right? When you play a pinball machine, it's a physical–

The ball is flying around, it's doing things in real, it's not a video game. It's not programmed, so things happen that can't happen, that shouldn't happen. The ball hits the glass or jumps over your flipper. These are all terrible things sometimes, but it's very random. And I think part of it is it's very Zen when you get into a flow because you're basically battling. You're going to lose ultimately. Like, the ball is going to drain eventually. But, while you're playing, one of the things people don't know is you're allowed to, they say, oh, it's tilting, it’s cheating, but you're supposed to kind of shake the machines. So you get this physical element to it as well. There's moves where like a slap, say, where you literally slap the machine. Normal life, you're not slapping things and shaking things and all that. So, not that I'm that aggressive or anything, but it's kind of fun. I'm pointing because I have a machine right there.

Paige Buck [00:38:58]:

Right there. And you get to feel the weight of that ball which I feel like feels so satisfying, too.

Gene Hwang [00:39:03]:

Yeah. And the longer you survive, because I think anybody who's played it ever, they're always like, it's so hard to keep it alive. As you do it, it's a good feeling and it's fun. And it's the same thing as the events industry. You have a lot of cool people you meet from all walks of life that are into this strange little passion. So it's just something that captured me, and I've been super addicted to it. So my free time, I try to travel to compete in tournaments and things. Just got back from one this weekend.

Paige Buck [00:39:31]:

Nice. How'd you do?

Gene Hwang [00:39:33]:

Got 11th in the main division. I won a side tournament, so that was fun. So, yeah, it was all good.

Paige Buck [00:39:41]:

How big is a tournament like that?

Gene Hwang [00:39:43]:

That one, I think the main tournament had like 160 people or something, but the smaller local stuff might just be 20 to 50 people or something like that. Yeah, we have a really thriving community here, so very lucky in San Francisco.

Paige Buck [00:39:59]:

It's been a long time since I've had–

Oh, it hasn't been that long. I'm thinking Alamo Drafthouse has some or had some. Anyway.

Gene Hwang [00:40:07]:

Yeah, they do. My Flash Gordon machine is in there.

Paige Buck [00:40:10]:

All right. I need to go seek it out. Thank you. That's fantastic. All right, Gene. Well, I know we will put in the show notes where everybody can find you. Thanks so much to Gene Hwang, co-founder of Orange Photography. It's been a pleasure.

Gene Hwang [00:40:24]:

Thanks, Paige.

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PAIGE BUCK

Paige Buck is the co-owner of Kennedy Events, a large-scale event management company based in San Francisco, Los Angeles, and New York City. Our team creates stress-free conferences and events with a positive impact, which allows our clients to resonate with their audience. Kennedy Events specializes in producing flawless product launches, award ceremonies, fundraisers, and multi-day conferences while keeping our eye on retention and engagement goals.

About Kennedy Events

Kennedy Events began with one goal in mind—to produce high-level corporate events with just as much strategy as style. Maggie founded the company in 2000, found her match in Paige, and in 2011 the two became official partners. Since then, these two resourceful and brilliant creatives have pooled their strengths to build one one of the most the most sought after corporate event companies in San Francisco, New York, and Los Angeles.